Why Are Men In the MGTOW Movement So Angry?
MGTOW is a movement for men that stands for Men Going Their Own Way. Before doing any research about this group of men I knew who they were. I have come across their comments on some of my Loving FLR YouTube videos and they are always very angry, aggressive and mean spirited. These men pledge to steer clear of all relationships with women because they believe women intentionally try to hurt them.
After reading their beautifully crafted website and taking a look at some of the videos they post to their community of men it seems that these men are the most hateful men on the planet. Men can ‘go their own way’ without berating women. Men can ‘go their own way’ without behaving like they have no respect for the wombs they were born from. Suffice it to say these MGTQW men are the opposite of the Gentlemen we appreciate in Loving FLRs.
Why is there so much anger in the words written by the MGTOW men? What are they being so defensive about? Why do they feel threatened? Why are they so angry? Who hurt them? Why do they feel like they are losing when it comes to women? Hasn’t this patriarchal society catered to men enough to appease them? What else do they want? Do they want to wipe women off the face of the Earth so that they can live happily ever after playing video games, drinking beer and grunting at each other? Sounds kind of homoerotic to me. Is that the kind of world that they want or am I missing something? For a group who claims to be disgusted by women they sure spend a lot of time focused on them.
The video below was created by a man who attaches the MGTOW label to the title of his video. The video details reasons why women don’t like nice guys. Some of his reasoning:
- Women see nice guys as weak.
- Nice guys are not exciting or interesting at all.
- When you think of a nice guy in your mind, the first thing you think of is a wimpy loser.
- Women are generally repelled by nice guys.
- Women say they want nice guys and end up dating bad boys.
- The only time women want a nice guy is when women hit the wall at age 30 and their looks go downhill.
- Women will resent a nice guy because deep down psychologically women do not believe that she deserves nice treatment without earning it.
- Believes nice guys are beta male providers who are socially awkward.
- Nice guys are really fake nice guys in disguise because the second a nice guy is rejected the nice guy act goes out the door.
- Women don’t want nice guys, because unlike nice guys, bad boys put them in their place when they do something wrong.
At LovingFLR.Com we LOVE nice guys! We don’t think they are weak at all. We have many battles to fight in life and we are grateful that we won’t have to fight any battles inside our homes. We APPRECIATE nice Gentleman who love us and are willing to help us to create a peaceful home life that allows us a break from the sometimes chaotic and cruel world.
We don’t want drama. There is enough of it in the news. We know we deserve all the benefits that come with being with a nice guy. We have plans and goals and are poised to impact the world. We don’t need to be put in our place. We rightfully take our place as leaders of our households and soon enough, our society.
It’s quite alright, Men of MGTOW. We understand that your pain is being reflected onto women for whatever you feel is lacking in your lives. The answer is clear. The answer is here. You crave the loving support and authority of a powerful woman who will kiss away your tears, remind you of why you were created and push you to be your best.
We still love you. And we are waiting for you to join us and receive the love you know is missing. We’re not against you. We want you to win too. You don’t have to go your own way. We have a better plan for you. Accepting your true desire for a Loving Female Led Relationship may be the best decision you will make all year.
This is what you really need, isn’t it?
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I am an alpha male. I am also a nice guy. I believe that a man can submit to his Woman in strength.
I am string yet flexible like leather and I can bend and flex in that strength. I am not strong like glass that shatters at the first flex.
More interesting are the silent MGTOWs. The ones who don’t participate in the online nonsense and who may not even realize there’s a name for what they’re already doing.
It’s been my experience that they don’t hate women, rather they value their time and after having had many poor experiences have figured out that a better way to spend their time is on their own passions ( hobbies and such ).
I certainly don’t hate women. I simply don’t see the value in dating and/or relationships. My experiences have been overwhelmingly negative and I see no reason to believe that would change. I also don’t want to subject myself to the grinder that is the marriage and divorce industry which is so anti-male it’s a wonder any man would knowingly subject himself to it ( and, point of fact, more and more men are opting out of that game ).
This helps me to understand you all better. Thank you for sharing without the mean words. I understand completely now.
Glad to have been of assistance.
No man can submit to a female unless he’s gay or a mangina. MGTOW is a logical and adaptive response to demonic entitled “modern” “women.”
If a man isn’t MGTOW he is unlearned, weak, homosexual or pridefully stupid.
women fear what they dont understand bevause modern whore women are full of entitlement , delusions and 100 mens cum she cannot think straight(schizo-cant pairbond) and logical put one and one together to get two. women also dont give a shit about what it means to be a man they just try tgeir best to castrate men and steal everything from men. so dont point the finger at men for logically adapting to a bunch of psycho women. women as a whole need to work on reflecting deep instead of always pretending they are the angel victim. womens character is utterly repulsive today completely lacking feminine ladylike qualitues, truth, dignitt and respect. why would men want to deal with baaically morally criminal and mentally ill women?
women will be alone or in fema(female) camps unless they humble to the truth and not their bullshit feelings.
Here’s a damn good example of why men are leaving women and relationships with women
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/07/23/texas-man-ordered-to-pay-65g-in-child-support-for-kid-that-isnt-his.html
THIS MAN HAS PROVEN THIS CHILD IS NOT HIS BY DNA TESTING, AND THE STATE OF TEXAS IS STILL SAYING HE HAS TO PAY HER $65,000 ! !!!
The divorce courts alone in many states have made it nearly impossible for men to get 50/50 custody of children, and many unfair and prejudiced things happen about alimony
Women teach men how to hate women. Men love women, are born to love women. But their moms, sisters, aunts, teachers make sure to demonize them for being men and simultaneously attack other women and girls behind their back. Men learn to either worship the ground women walk on or learn the disgusting and hateful behaviors of women. Often they learn both and are in constant turmoil on whether they should accept female nature or be disgusted by it. Once these men get destroyed by a woman they cared about that pushes them into a wider understanding and many seem to be finding the red pill or Mgtow. Once again, Men are born to love women but women teach them not to.
Wow. I see where you are coming from. I do know men who hate women because of women. I know women who hate men for the same reason. Here at Loving FLR, we encourage respect for women and men and a relationship that is mutually agreeable.
I love the idea of this website and it’s propositions for female les relationships, but without a proper understanding of MGTOW, there won’t be an understanding of men, and FLR’s are statistically doomed to fail regardless of that understanding, due to deeply ingrained biological realities in the human species. When men are angry, you should listen HARDER, not shame them into expressing their emotions in traditionally feminine ways (crying, talking, etc). You guys probably have good intentions but you know what they say about the road to hell. Good luck with your FLR’s. I actually do hope they work out. For real.
PS: Don’t claim to love men and use the word patriarchy seriously, simultaneously. It makes you look stupid yet cruel.
I was not trying to shame men at all, I truly did not understand. All the mean comments I get on my videos make me feel mad and sad for the MGTOW men.
Can you suggest ways we can make our concept of FLRs work better? I teach women how to relate to men in a mature and appreciative manner. Can you offer tips for lessons you wish women would learn that would help them to have better relationships with men? I am open to learning and sharing good wisdom?
At least you seem to acknowledge that human relationships are never equal. There is always a leader and a follower. You’re fighting a losing battle against the biological inclinations of both men and women by trying to promote relationships where the woman leads and the man follows though. I’ve never witnessed an “FLR” that wasn’t grossly dysfunctional, but that’s just my own anecdotal observation.
I don’t think there’s such a thing as a man who *desires* a woman to lead him other than perhaps men with “fem dom” fetishes or Oedipus complexes. There are tons of men out there who will submit to women, but not because they want to so much as because they have to in order to (temporarily) preserve the relationship. Those relationships always end with the woman growing bored of and discarding the guy though. Those men are called “simps”, and they are a potent form of pussy repellent.
Anyway, good luck with that.
I find it both sad and interesting that you view crying (a very normal human emotion and response) and talking (also normal and rational) as ‘traditionally feminine.’ Dont get me wrong, I dont blame you for feeling this way. Maybe thats another thing wrong with our society, telling men to never express their emotions, telling men that crying is feminine, telling men that talking out their feelings isn’t masculine… those are all lies bro.
You are a human being, all humans, regardless of gender, have feelings and emotions, and to shame yourself as a man for feeling them is wrong. You are taking away natural coping mechanisms, and by doing that it makes it harder to deal with how you feel inside. I am not religious at all, but many people admire Jesus, and the shortest, most powerful verse in the bible is ‘Jesus wept.’ How we got to the point in our society when being a human is somehow shamed is beyond me.
I am very glad to be searching for a loving FLR, thank you for taking on this interesting and divisive topic. Your videos are a great resource and I value your posts here. Its nice to finally feel at home.
Just like any other support group, MGTOW has its angry elements. And it’s no wonder – we have been lied to, bamboozled, divorce raped into poverty, had the best years of our lives taken from us, and have had fraud committed against us in bulk (paternity fraud, reproductive fraud, etc.).
The anger that comes from being bent over a barrel by the hands of society and our legal system, and shafted repeatedly to the glee and laughter of the “gentler sex”, can be very, very loud.
Those that can heal, eventually quiet down. They move through the other stages of grief and then truly go their own way as they heal. You can see them enjoying their lives, independent, in comfortable solitude with themselves. Those kinds of men do not need validation from women to have meaning and purpose in our lives. We have seen the cancer that is modern feminism, and we have turned away in disgust.
We have recognized the playing field as being tilted massively – and hilariously so – against us, and we have quietly exited the field in contempt. We have learned that because of the nature of the game, fighting back would only make us even bigger “bad guys” in the eyes of society and the law, and that sometimes the only way to win is not to play.
The juice is no longer worth the squeeze, and hasn’t been for a long time. And this, coming from a man who has already been around the block (death did us part) once in his near-five decades on this rock.
Edit: Should have ended that first paragraph with,
“; to say nothing about having our children torn from us by the deeply misandrist court systems that favour only the women, and have no problem with these women denying us our due access.”
Yeah, it’s a massive white elephant that no-one is willing to address, least of all those who benefit (lawyers, women, etc.). I haven’t been a victim of this particular issue, but I have directly known two who had; and the abject, man-hating cruelty that they were forced to submit to from all levels of the legal system would make any rational being pick up a shotgun and start dispensing justice from the judge on down. What these fathers go through has no place in a world based on fairness and equality.
i was in law school and the lopsidedness of the courts against men is ingrained for one reason: women used to have no jobs, no income, no power, nothing, and if they were divorced, they were literally alone and destitute with children on the street or in churches or in shelters. They were powerless, and the courts stepped in to give them power. Times have changed now, but the laws are 20-30 years behind the changes in society. Those laws WILL change over time, but unfortunately men are caught in the gears until this happens. It sucks, its unfair, and its wrong but understanding the history of it, instead of seeing it through a conspiracy or some how targeting men is not helping the situation. Are the courts fucked up? yes. an it feel personal? yes. Is it a conspiracy by snickering women to bash men, no, its part of the system, call it whatever you will.
Scott has something very important to say. I’ve been appalled by stories I’ve read about the unfair treatment men have received at the hands of the family courts.
Have a look at this story: http://www.city-data.com/forum/colorado/1025301-alimony-warning-colorado-worst-state.html. It is very typical of what I’ve seen.
The short version is that a man wrote that his wife is leaving him for another man and his lawyer informs him that he can expect to pay over $2000 in alimony to her per month for the rest of his life.
People like me are afraid of this happening to them. I am fortunate to have a wife at my side who has shown undying love and devotion to myself and our child. It offends me that courts and lawyers stand ready to give me the same treatment the man in the above story received at the drop of a hat.
I’ve done a little background reading, and basically, the gist of it is that in the past, paying alimony to an ex-wife was considered punishment for adultery. With today’s no-fault divorces, such a policy no longer makes sense and lends itself to empowering selfish women to perform what amounts to legalised extortion, with the full force of the state!
The good news is that the chance Scott is looking for seems to be underway. These policies are set at the state level and many states have been making changes to try to stop the injustice, even though the change has been happening slowly. As a result, it seems that the majority of the worst stories out there come from a handful of states that have yet to update their laws.
Florida is known as one of the worst offenders, with stories out there about men being ordered to pay lifetime alimony to women who divorced them in their 30s. One such man was facing jail for being unable to pay alimony, and so he protested by burning himself alive on the courthouse steps. How’s that for anger?
I would urge that women who write about relationships take the time to speak up in no uncertain terms that this is completely wrong! And as a man, I know that there are also stories about women who were unable to get the support they needed from the courts after faithfully serving their men for many years, and I believe that this is equally wrong!
But all that being said, it seems to me that the MGTOW movement of men avoiding relationships with women because some women treat their men abominably is like if I avoided eating because of the chance of getting food poisoning. The solution isn’t to starve; the solution is to practice good sanitation and prevent food poisoning.
How bad have women gotten that men are walking away? 70% of men 18 to 34 are not married. What does that tell you? Men aren’t interested in relationships, normal, flr, or otherwise.
This is a joke right? Most men are MGTOW because they were in relationships where women were in control. Women only want a small percentage of the male population, an average girl “settles” for an average guy. There are very few women for average guys, average women would rather wait her turn to be with an exceptional guy. Or openly share him with other women. She gets to have him for week or one night, but never a lifetime. The average guy is lucky to have ANY woman and women know it. Average women treat average men poorly because they can; they never have to meet their men half way. Poor treatment is supported by pop culture and the courts. For the average man, it’s rigged game and we don’t want to play anymore.
What makes you average? Your looks? Your career achievements? Your penis size? I think there are lots of women who want a man who respects them more than a man who is commercially celebrated.
Every woman I’ve ever tried to respect has walked all over me. Simple as that. Not interested in more of the same, and I have no reason to believe that the next one is ‘not like all those other women’
Female…led…relationship.
Let me try that again, without laughing, female led relationship. As opposed to what? Relationships are female led. Female led relationships are the norm, not the exception. If you were being truthful, you would state directly led or indirectly led.
By the by, what sort of research did you do without coming across Briffault’s law?
Women create and control the conditions that establish and/or maintain relationships.
MGTOW is a non-collectivist philosophy. And it’s men are angry, to a degree, because we cannot escape women.
The government caters to you. Western styled governments of the world, have allowed feminism to take full root.
Men cannot even get a fair shake at paternity (you have, sometimes, a limited time to appeal, even if you have no chance of being the father).
Female genital mutiliation is bad, male genital mutilation aka circumcision is a-okay. Your body, your choice is only for women.
If women commit a crime, you are often exempted from its consequences. The news media cannot even bring itself to say when a woman rapes a boy. So they use euphemisms like romp or affair, not rape or molestation.
A woman can put you in jail, on a whim, for committing no crime. Just her word alone. This happened to me, so I know what I am talking about. You have women only spaces, and you are the majority of the population.
Men are going MGTOW because it is impossible to escape you and your shadow and your influence.
You have hordes upon hordes of white knight manginas ready to do battle for you, for the hope, the wish, the possibility of getting into your panties, because they are nice guys. You have Chad and Tyrone, at the ready to make your panties moist, willing to go out of their way to do it.
You love nice guys. Ha,ha, that’s nice, that rich. You love em because nice guys are useful idiots. These loveable, as you say anyways, manginas, blue pilled, and white knights. Of course you like them. In other news, water is wet and the sun is hot. No duh. You need these men, to wife you, when your speed into the wall. You need a useful idiot to pickup the pieces. You need a man, so stupid, so self sacrificing, that he allows you to break the systemperature and pursue your dream and in the end, become a wife, the envy of her CC riding friends.
My first wife tried a female led relationship, to its rational end, she wanted the right to sleep with other men (which she did) and she wanted power to make me like it (which never happened).
There is a great saying around some of the MGTOW forums.
Men love women, women love children.
You ladies, I truly doubt you love any man, he’s just a walking handyman and ATM.
Most men don’t want to have a relationship or marry a woman that sleeps around. Yes you decide what you do with your life and you can have sex with everyone you want, though most men will not respect a woman like that. Yes most men will have sex with you but they will not want a serious relationship or even marry you. There is a saying you can’t turn a ho into a housewife. You have to realize there are consequences to the choices you make. It’s really that simple. You can say it’s the past, though we somehow yet if we buy a car we want to know how many mileage it has run, the amount of owners it had and if it had a good maintenence. We just don’t want damaged goods.
We want a feminine woman who is loyal, dedicated, honest, direct and supportive. Instead most women are highly toxic, narcissistic, lying and manipulative, demanding, insecure, controlling, attention seekers, hypergamist, monkey branchers, materialistic.
Men carry a lot of weight on their shoulders and the last thing he wants is coming home listening to a nagging woman, who will never be satisfied with whatever the man has to offer.